Russian smoke detectors (EDIT: Bad idea!!!)

[tim.hbn]

Hi Andrey

Thank you very much indeed for your very informative reply and sorry for the delay in replying. I have been very busy.

It therefore sounds like it is a very bad idea so I won't persue it any further.

Kind regards

Tim

[MartinM]

There is a large difference between the newer RID-6M and older RID-1/KI-1 (which Carl Willis examined) in terms of active material content. A 100-fold difference. Each of those devices contains 2 sources.
RID-6M should be 2x 5.7 uCi, while the older ones have 100x more: 2x 0.57 mCi.
Activity of the RID-6M (the majority coming from Am241 daughter) is quite low, ~0.5 uSv/h, so hardly measurable at some distance and with some shielding... That's all I'll say :D

[Lposter]

I dont want to revive a dead thread but this from today shows how bad an idea this can be (the item in question was I believe, a Russian smoke detector bought online from one of the usual places). But an exampke is being made of this chap who should have done some reading first.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... ium-ntwnfb

Lars

[Magnus7]

The hazmat procedures in Sydney sounds like a storm in a tea cup.
An old alarm clock with radium painted hands is probably more dangerous.
"They confiscated plutonium and depleted uranium in decorative vials and polymer cubes that Lidden kept by his bedside after buying from a US science collectables website to complete a real-life periodic table."

[Lposter]

This chap has landed himself in a bit of a pickle.....

The cubes that that website used to sell (not any more) were the "cores" from the old Soviet detectors. These are harmless. The hazmat response was ridiculous.

BUt the problem for him is that those cubes , according to what I have read, contain amounts of Pu-239. And that puts the material in this category (as defined by IAEA safeguards):

4.1. Nuclear material. Any source material or special fissionable material as defined in Article XX of the Statute of the IAEA; see also para. 112 of [153], para. 77 of [66] and Article 18.h of [540].

4.5. Special fissionable material. As defined in the Statute of the IAEA (Article XX.1): “[P]lutonium-239; uranium-233; uranium enriched in the isotopes 235 or 233; any material containing one or more of the foregoing; and such other fissionable material as the Board of Governors shall from time to time determine; but the term ‘special fissionable material’ does not include source material.”

And that places it....technically....... under Arcticle III of the Non-Proliferation Treaty.

Its no harm, its not dangerous, its not going to make bomb.....but the presence of 239 brings it, probably, under that treaty and whatever laws Australia have around it.

There is...legally...for countries signed up to that treaty...no exempt quantity of certain isotopes and 239 is, arguably legally, one of them.

You can have exempt quantities of some Pu isotopes (as tracers etc) but even those are probably subject to safeguards regimes.

So, dependent on the lawyers and political will, he could be found in breach of whatever laws Australia has regarding the NPT/Safeguards.

This is sad for him..... he is obviously going to be a type of test case because some over eager lawyer/government agency has a point to make or a budget to justify.

In addition Australia always has like to highlight its strong border/security regimes. And this is a great way for them to indicate to other countries that they are "all over this".

Especially given the world we live in. And the fact that they are soon going to have nuclear submarines.

Its worth noting that this chap is not the first to end up in deep doodoo because of these smoke detectors. During the Great Plutonium Flood of 1994-1997, two Austrians were nabbed either in Germany or Switzerland with a couple of these detectors. Not sure what happened to them but no doubt it was just to give them a good scare.

Its worth noting that there have been arguments posed before that even Pu spectra can be seen to fall foul of the NPT treaty in that legal arguments can be made as to the spectra themselves containing information that can be said to breach the spirit of the treaty. This being due to the fact that certain U spectra and Pu probably contain more information than any other isotope and that certain thing scan be inferred from teh spectra.

I dont think its ever been tested in court but I have seen the argument made........

Either way, its highly unfortunate for this fella - he really has fallen foul of over eager prosecutors/authorities and I hope it works out for him.

Lars